Outfit #2

“(Un)buttoned Shirt and Belted Dress”

CS: This is my most ‘Carrie’ outfit. And this is the most cleavage I’ve ever shown… and it’s in the photoshoot with my mother.

MB: [shields face playfully and looks away]

KJ: What was your mom’s style like when she was in her twenties?

CS: She’ll always say, ‘It wasn’t my fault.’ When she was my age, it was the ‘80s—the fashion was just awful. And she was no exception to the rule.

MB: I feel like that [points to Caroline’s outfit] is what I would be wearing all the time. We brought that back for you guys. When I was growing up, you couldn’t wear pants to school. But I was always comfortable in jeans.

CS: You weren’t trendy, but…she always had short, curly hair, [she] never had long hair. She would wrap up a bandana super-duper tight, like in a roll, and use it as a headband. And wear it with a big T-shirt. She was cool, but it’s not like she just walked out of Vogue. And she’d wear that cooking, you know, she’d be cracking crab shells and drinking Zima.

KJ: How has Caroline’s style changed since high school? Has it always reflected her personality well?

MB: I would go out and buy Gap [clothes for her], and she would never wear them. It was so frustrating!

CS: I’ve always been obsessed with Carrie Bradshaw. I would watch [“Sex and the City”] when I wasn’t supposed to. And my mom would be like, ‘If you’re going to watch it anyway, I can help explain some things.’ It was raunchy, but I was so obsessed. I would re-wear her outfits to school. I was also really chubby. I was a chubby seventh grader trying to be Carrie Bradshaw.

MB: She is definitely unique and has her own beat going on in her head. Nobody wanted to be like her ever – she’s been her own person. And she’s really, really principled. If she’s your friend, she will never tell a secret. And she’s not afraid to say uncomfortable things to people she doesn’t know, to tell someone she doesn’t like something. I think I was more afraid. But she’s strong like that, a good businesswoman. She knows how to ask for what she wants. I’m proud of her music, but I’m also proud of her being a strong woman in an industry that’s dominated by men.

KJ: How would you describe your mom’s personality, and whether that’s reflected in her style?

CS: She moved to northern Minnesota from Pittsburgh, and that’s what her style reflected. ‘Big City Girl’ in a small town. She’d always be the one with the black leather purse, the nice stuff. You know, sunglasses on, click-click-clacking down the elementary school hallway to go to parent teacher conferences.

KJ: I think one of your most memorable lyrics, Caroline, is ‘I wanna look like my mama, five-foot-two and a natural woman.’ What makes your mom a natural woman, and why do you aspire to that?

CS: The lyric came from… like why would you want to look like Kate Moss? I mean, figuratively. If that doesn’t exist in your bloodline, then why would you aspire to that? I mean, Kate Moss has never come to your door and inspired you to be a better person. So it was about wanting to look like the women that inspire you in your life, that inspire you and make you a better person. Growing up, my mom was always like, ‘We’re going to talk about everything you’ve experienced, openly.’ I didn’t need a therapist with her around. Looking up to that kind of body is a healthier way of looking up to someone. You have to be sassy in this business. Everyone is always saying, ‘You have to think like a man.’ But I can’t think like a man. I like thinking like a woman. I like feeling compassionate, overwhelmed, and emotional; that’s what makes me a passionate person.

KJ: And how did you feel when you heard that lyric, Martha?

MB: One of my favorite responses was that Emma’s mom heard it and started crying. What touched me is people’s responses to that line, not necessarily what she said. I’m always in her songs, I come up a lot, so in that video when she waved, I thought, ‘Oh, that’s so cute.’ But I think it touched other moms and daughters a little more. I wouldn’t watch it on repeat, but it is cute. I listen to [Caroline’s friends] talk about womanhood and motherhood…but I’m just surviving and taking care of kids and women. But this is what they’re noticing about me, so that’s what empowers me.

CS: We didn’t use the word ‘feminist’ in our house. That just got reclaimed recently. So she wouldn’t call herself a feminist, but then she’d be hosting a Vagina Monologues at her coffee shop. And she was always shoving Women Who Run With Wolves [by Clarissa Pinkola Estés] in my lap at every moment.

MB: We had to go to work; it wasn’t an option not to go to work. I never saw myself as a role model, but now I feel empowered by it. And other people’s mothers are like, ‘Oh, yeah, I guess I’m natural, too!’ I am inspired by [Caroline] a lot. If I need something, she would be my first go-to, and vice versa. There’s been so many things that happened in our lives that weren’t perfect. But in the end, that’s what makes us strong.

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